Re: kol isha in action

[Lori Cahan-Simon <l_cahan...>]

Jordan wrote:

>
> I really wish all those who have not been through the Kol Isha wars on 
> this list would check the old postings if they are available and 
> consult them. 

Just because we've discussed an issue before doesn't mean there isn't 
room for another.  I remember every round we've had over the last few 
years and new points are discussed each time.  Jordan, I don't see you 
objecting each time any other subject is brought up repeatedly.

> Quite frankly, I think that Lori should find a feminist support group 
> to vent her feelings. 

I don't think that was a necessary statement.  I believe this is 
absolutely the appropriate venue to discuss the issue.

> Not because they are illegitimate. Not because I  follow the 
> restrictions of Kol Isha(which I do not) . Simply because a discussion 
> of a principle of Halacha, even one with admittedly various 
> interpretations, is fruitless in an environment where actual knowledge 
> or lack thereof of halacha does not give anyone pause to make the most 
> uninformed, anti orthodox, offensive statements about a practice which 
> is in the Shulchan Aruch, which is for all the branches of Jewish 
> practice at least the starting off point for discussions of Halacha. 
> You want to talk about how Orthodoxy is repressive? Be my guest. As an 
> Orthodox practitioner, I can assure you you are correct. Just don't do 
> it on a list about Jewish Music.

But that's what this point is about, Jordan--Jewish Music.

> Because I did not come here to be subject to the kind of reflexive 
> anti Orthodox, or Anti Halacha diatribes which are common every time 
> this comes up. You want to change the practice? Tell people not to 
> follow that halacha. Just don't do it here. And as I have said every 
> time this comes up, if you are going to discuss this, look at the 
> original source material and at least understand why it is the way it is.

When the wonderful sources were listed last time I certainly did go and 
read them, long and intense as they were, and still did not get a sense 
of how the development of the practice makes sense.  At what point does 
a speaking voice become singing?  Where is the line?  

>  And to tell the truth, Lori, if this happens to you so often,

And now with the personal attack based on incomplete understanding of 
the subject.  I never said this happened to ME often, but it does happen 
to WOMEN often.

> maybe you need to put safeguards in place so that you don't get hurt 
> in this way.

I am not hurt.  I have not taken it personally.  I am outraged at the 
injustice from a people who have a history of fighting for social 
justice.  I am outraged at other aspects which I won't go into now.  I'm 
disappointed that you, who admonish others to know the facts, did not 
bother to find them out from me before you assume I am ignorant and weak.

>  Don't assume you don't have to be upfront about who is in your group,

I was merely the hired hand for this job, and not present at the 
organizers' meeting, therefore not able to address any of this, and when 
I attempted to speak with one of them by phone yesterday, she wouldn't 
even allow me to discuss it with her and cut me off.

> or what it is you do, because anyone who follows Kol Isha is wrong. 
> Accept that this is halacha, at least for some people, and as such has 
> a degree of sanctity. If you can't do that, stop working for Jews.

I am not one for making personal attacks, but that's just a stupid 
remark, Jordan.  I refuse to even honor your statement with reasons or 
rebuttals.


Thank you for all your support, my friends.  I will continue to voice my 
opinion about the injustice of this practice.  If God gave me this gift, 
who is a man to tell me not to use it for God's work?

I'll work out the rest from here.  

mit frayndshaft,
Lorele

-- 
You can now hear Lori's new CD, Songs My Bubbe Should Have Taught Me; Vol.1: 
Passover, at: http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/lcahan Only $15 & postage. Email me for 
more info.
 




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