Re: Kol Isha

[Eliezer Kaplan <zelwel...>]

Winston-
    If you want my pov, go back into the archives the last time this topic
came up, & you'll find it there.
    I'm Orthodox (at least if one wants to make arbitrary divisions, and try
and label deeply held personal beliefs which develop over lifetimes, one
could probably call me that),  I think the Kol Isha thing is idiotic (please
don't blast me, Jordan- I'm not trying to start a flame war- I'm just trying
to be realistic and relevant to the world we live in), and I personally
don't observe the restriction.
    My wife tells a story about a family that always would always cut the
corners off the roast before putting it the oven. One day, someone thought
to ask Grandma if she knew why it was done- her answer? Because her
grandma's pan was shaped that way. Sometimes the institutionalized piece of
a religion can be like that.
    On the other hand (and, 99.9% of the time there IS an other hand) our
father's traditions are in our hands- it's not a simple thing to change
traditions, though, over the course of time, like it or not, guys (and
gals), they do change.
    As far as female vocalists go, have I mentioned Abida Parveen? Sings
like an angel...
                                    EK



----- Original Message -----
From: "WINSTON WEILHEIMER" <nusach (at) hotmail(dot)com>
To: "World music from a Jewish slant" <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 12:43 PM
Subject: Re: Kol Isha


> Do we REALLY want to get into this discussion further on this list...im
> willing, but there are other lists more appropriate.  Eliezer, an
> observtion.  If you do not wish to share your own personal views, simply
> don't comment on these issues.  when you reply, you are bound to be asked
to
> comment from your pov.
>
> As to those on the list who are offended by KOL ISHA issue, (as I am) I am
> perfectly willing to let those in the orthodox community continue to live
in
> the past and suggest that women boycott their functions on the basis of
the
> protest!  It won't matter to them, cause don't want you there in the first
> place.
> winston
> ***********************************************************************
>
> >From: "Eliezer Kaplan" <zelwel (at) earthlink(dot)net>
> >Reply-To: jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
> >To: World music from a Jewish slant <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
> >Subject: Re: Kol Isha
> >Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 10:30:06 -0600
> >
> > > In my view (and many others agree), Judaism has survived only because
it
> >has
> > > accepted change,
> >
> >Marvin- 2 words- Intermarriage Rate. I don't think Judaism is really
> >surviving in America!
> >                     EK
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Marvin" <physchem (at) telocity(dot)com>
> >To: "World music from a Jewish slant" <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
> >Sent: Sunday, February 18, 2001 10:03 AM
> >Subject: Re: Kol Isha
> >
> >
> > > To show where I "come from" on this matter, I'm a Reform Jew who
> > > has studied Torah (my mixed male/female group finished the last of the
> >five
> > > books late last year, after spending an hour most weeks for more than
> >four
> > > years with our Rabbi, reading and debating line by line), but not
> >Talmud.
> >I
> > > respect the differing views of other Jews, but I don't accept claims
> >some
> > > make that their views are the only legitimate ones, or that it has
> >"always
> > > been that way".  I especially resent those who say I'm not Jewish.
> >Perhaps
> > > they need to be reminded that, not matter how observent thay are,
there
> >is
> > > always someone who thinks he is holier.
> > >
> > > A couple of years ago, the question of who Jacob wrestled with came up
> >on
> >a
> > > Jewish humor newsgroup.  I made the comment that in a modern context,
> > > considering the circumstances surrounding Jacob's experience, one
might
> >say
> > > that he wrestled with his conscience.  I quickly got an e-mail
informing
> >me
> > > that only rabbis are allowed to make such comments.  I mention that
only
> >as
> > > an example of the kind of thinking I won't accept.
> > >
> > > In my view (and many others agree), Judaism has survived only because
it
> >has
> > > accepted change, most notably when the priesthood lost out to the
> >rabbis.
> > > The change is still going on, and one modern aspect is the growing
> >rights
> >of
> > > women.  When they want to, even the most Orthodox rabbis manage to
find
> > > reason to change halachah.  In terms of women singing, I understand
that
> > > more than half the cantorial students for the last several years have
> >been
> > > women, and they are accepted by both Conservative and Reform
> >congregations.
> > > The numerically prevailing view among congregation rabbis in the US
> >supports
> > > women as cantors, which doesn't mean that all rabbis must accept them.
> > >
> > > I don't automatically give in to those who wish to control a group
> >(e.g.,
> >a
> > > concert) by objecting that an activity isn't allowed under the rules
> >that
> > > they follow.  There are other interpretations by rabbis who are well
> > > qualified.  I wouldn't force anyone to violate his principles, but the
> > > person who is offended can leave the room.
> > >
> > > Conflicts of laws and rights occur in other contexts, and in the U.S.
> >there
> > > is a principle often stated as "your rights end at the tip of my
nose".
> > >
> > > Marvin Margoshes
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
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