RE: G-d un doss kelbl

[Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky <reyzl...>]

Sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry, sorry.

I made a mistake.  I am so glad you caught it.

In my mind, Wolf Younin wrote Dona Dona and I have mistakenly uttered this 
once before off-line.  The data is probably stored in my mind this way, 
because he told me a lot about the song and I am always surprised to find 
songs he wrote that I didn't know about.  So at this point I am confused 
about his body of works.  My mistake.  Just checked and I see that Chana 
Mlotek also writes in "Pearls of Yiddish Song" that the song was originally 
titled "Dana, dana".

It's just that when I see people throwing out theories into space about 
things they don't know, but certainly have good access to checking (e.g., 
writing to the expert Chana Mlotek at YIVO), it drives me bananas.   This 
kind of guessing glat in the velt arayn (=into space) going from Hebrew to 
Spanish, creating bad folk etymology when the information is available in 
multiple sources gets me upset.  I then write quickly because I want this 
issue out of my overstuffed computer.  There are so many uninformed people 
on this list and they can't tell the difference between what is good and 
bad hypothesizing.  They pick up all kinds of bad seeds and bad methodology 
this way.  Guessing by looking at similar words in other languages should 
really be done by trained linguists who always keep cultural contexts in 
mind.  It is also usually unproductive.

I am so glad this error has been immediately corrected.

This song by the way is called in both Yiddish and English "Dona, Dona" and 
not "Got un dos kelbl".

BTW, On the God issue, I can't remember the rabbis name and don't have time 
to look for it, but one of the supreme rabbinic experts in the 
pan-ultra-Orthodox world ruled that you can write God in English and not 
worry about it.  But some Ashkenazi Jews, unlike the more sensible 
Sefardim, like to pile on restrictions to show how much holier they are 
than other Jews, devised this "G-d" business.  Just forget about it.


Gut shabes,


Reyzl



----------
From:  Kame'a Media [SMTP:media (at) kamea(dot)com]
Sent:  Friday, February 23, 2001 6:13 PM
To:  World music from a Jewish slant
Subject:  Re: G-d un doss kelbl

Hi Reyzl;

We've missed you.

Unless I misunderstand your post, you are saying that Wolf Younin
was the composer of "Dona, Dona."

All my sources for this song say it was written by Aaron Zeitlin,
(for his play "Esterke," produced by Maurice Schwartz in 1940-1941)
with music by Sholem Secunda.

The lyrics have been erroneously attributed to Yitskhok Katznelson
in some collections.

=git shabes=

Wolf

Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky wrote:

> This is true about Bikel.
>
> The original word as the composer and lyricist sang and wrote it were
> "dana, dana".  (I heard it myself from the composer, Wolf Younin, whom I
> knew well.)  It later got changed to "dona", but I can't remember by whom
> or why.  Was this just the folk process or Theodore Bikel decision? 
 There
> are many people around who would know the history of this song to answer
> most questions.  But I am sure that it had nothing to do with "adonay".
>
> Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky
>
> ----------
> From:  Kame'a Media [SMTP:media (at) kamea(dot)com]
> Sent:  Friday, February 23, 2001 2:04 PM
> To:  World music from a Jewish slant
> Subject:  Re: G-d un doss kelbl
>
> Hi Paula:
>
> I believe Theodore Bikel sings it: "Donay, donay, donay...."
> But I agree Michel may be trying to read too much into it.
>
> Wolf
>
> PTAW85 (at) aol(dot)com wrote:
>
> > That's the first time I've heard it.  I have heard many native
> > Yiddish-speaking singers do this song, and never have I heard anyone
> > pronounce the words in the chorus other than "Dona, dona".  I think you
> may
> > be trying to read too much into it.
> >
> > Paula Teitelbaum
> >
> > In a message dated 2/23/01 8:41:24 AM, borzykowski (at) infomaniak(dot)ch 
writes:
> >
> > << In the famous song "Doss kelbl", the chorus "Dona dona", pronounced
> with a
> > *good* yiddish accent sounds like "Donay donay".
> >
> > I always wondered whether it was another way to call for G-d without
> > pronouncing His name and without singing "Hashem" (that obviously sound
> like
> > a fake).
> >
> > Any opinion?
> >
> > Michal (tso kikhal) >>
> >
>


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