Re: Making Judaism Cool

[Trudi Goodman <goobietheg...>]

Ari:
As you suggest...it's six of one and half a dozen of the other. I'm of a 
mind that people's positive interest in Judaism is at least positive..and 
I'll definitely take that over Anti-Semitism.  Ok, there is a point, where 
as a person who's been playing Yiddish music for over 25 years..long before 
it was hip and groovy..when bookers wanted to call my music Hebrew..because 
they didn't "get it" and thought everything Jewish was Hebrew...God knows 
what they thought Ladino was...one audition person very nastily said to me 
"Oh, Ladino...as opposed to Latino." Anyways...so I've been somewhat in the 
trenches at times, yes it is a pain in the tuchas when people are treating 
something that I love...and I love being Jewish and doing Jewish music and 
theatre...as a fad. It's downright insulting at times...my only hope is that 
some of these fadsters will hang in there with the wonderfulness of 
Yiddishkeyt and check it out in all of it's beautiful and glorious 
ramifications.
   Clearly I get easily pissed about what people view "Jewish" to be.  
That's my button pusher.  But in my own defense, I will say that I know that 
my Grandmother Gert who I'm named for, went through a tremendous amount of 
chazerei about not "really" being Jewish, even though her father James was 
adopted halachically and her husband was a Chazzan in the old country.  So 
what I'm saying about that...is that there are as many kinds of Jews as 
there are people...I guess I'll always keep saying that...even though people 
on the list may find it somewhat tiresome.  My feeling is that if you are 
taking the "licks" as well as having the joy of being a Jew then you've 
earned the title. And hey...that's where Roseanne came in.  Believe me, 
being an actor(I also have done stand-up) I've heard enough said about her 
being a JAP. -To which my response is(including when people call me this as 
well) That's right A JEWISH AMERICAN PERSON. If I'm being flip I'll say 
that's right I'm a..JEWISH AMERICAN POLISH PERSON...since my father's mom's 
name was Pollansky.
    Be Well and Zei Gezunt,
    Trudi the G(L.R.)

>From: Ari Davidow <ari (at) ivritype(dot)com>
>Reply-To: jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
>To: World music from a Jewish slant <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
>Subject: Re: Making Judaism Cool
>Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 12:09:06 -0400
>
>I assumed that the author was making an assumption that Roseanne
>was unlikely to be a scholar and that people attending a kabbalah
>class she taught were attracted by her celebrity. It did seem like
>a riff that had more to do with assumptions, as you bring up, Trudi,
>than what the author was talking about, which seemed to have something
>to do with treating Jewish-related artifacts (Radical Jewish Culture,
>for instance) as an ostensible substitute for Jewish culture.
>
>There are obviously some problems with that. There =is= a phenomenon,
>I think, where people of Jewish ancestry but no particular Jewish
>knowledge, who are already comfortably situated in secular culture,
>find relatively shallow phenomena sufficient to meet their "Jewish"
>needs. Some such people undoubtedly also go deeper as/if they get
>interested in the Jewish culture that gave rise to some of the new
>Jewish music that they hear at places like the Knit.
>
>I think that the author is smirking, maybe in a vein similar to Ruth
>Wisse's comments in her paragraphs about Henry Sapoznik's book in which
>she derided the idea of klezmer/yiddish culture as counterculture; in
>her view, "Judaism", by which I believe she means "living a traditionally
>Jewish life in a larger culture which fights such particularlism" is the
>"true" counterculture.
>
>If so, a larger point is surely being missed, which is that not all Jews,
>even those who are (or who feel themselves to be) very involved as Jews,
>look at traditional Jewish culture as the framework for that involvement.
>An easy example would be gays and lesbians, especially gay men, who
>would not be welcome as out gays in most traditional congregations.
>
>And, at the same, time, klezmer and other Jewish music (once, perhaps
>just klezmer, but now surely relating to a wider variety of middle eastern,
>sephardic, liturgical from everywhere chants and music), and/or a presumed
>secular Yiddish culture, have played roles in expanding the community's
>sense of how one "lives" Jewishly or identifies Jewishly, overall.
>
>Which still, circling around one last time, doesn't cancel the fact that
>there are lots of people encountering some unfamiliar (to them) aspect
>of Judaism or Jewish culture that seem "cool" this year, who will have
>moved on to other things a year from now. Is this glass somewhat empty
>because some people are shallow, or somewhat full because each gilgul
>(revolution of the wheel) provides a door for some people to encounter
>more of Judaism?
>
>ari
>
>At 02:44 PM 6/20/00 -0700, you wrote:
> >Nu?
> >Why not?  Maybe she has the yeshiva education to do so?
> >An open mind is always useful, Robert.
> >Is the problem because she's a woman or what?
> >One of the best Kabbalic scholars I ever met was a woman...and a 
>Lubavicher.
> >  If they didn't have a problem with that why should you.
> >Hey, I know you'll tell me...and that's what makes a horse race
> >Be Well AND...
> >Hey welcome to the 21st century.
> >Trudi(LR)
> >
> >
> >>From: "Robert Cohen" <rlcm17 (at) hotmail(dot)com>
> >>Reply-To: jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
> >>To: World music from a Jewish slant <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
> >>Subject: Re: Making Judaism Cool
> >>Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 09:34:28 PDT
> >>
> >>I'll sidestep the Judaism being cool debate until I've considered and
> >>reflected more on the phenomenon (if then), but as a far as Roseanne, 
>the
> >>issue is not whether she cares about being Jewish, contributes to Jewish
> >>causes (I'm delighted if she does), or, for that matter, wants to study
> >>Judaism--though Kabbalah would usually be considered an inappropriate 
>place
> >>to begin.  The issue is whether she should be *teaching* (which is, I
> >>assume, what is meant by "leading") Kabbalah studies (which, at least on
> >>its
> >>face, sounds absurd).  The answer is almost certainly No.
> >>
> >>--Robert Cohen
> >>
> >>
> >>>From: "Trudi Goodman" <goobietheg (at) hotmail(dot)com>
> >>>Reply-To: jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
> >>>To: World music from a Jewish slant <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
> >>>Subject: Re: Making Judaism Cool
> >>>Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 12:32:30 PDT
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>  Hey why shouldn't Roseanne be leading kabbalah studies...does the 
>fact
> >>>that she is a performer mean that she doesn't care about being Jewish?
> >>>No...as a matter of fact she has given long-standing support to the 
>Jewish
> >>>Community, particularly through Jewish Charities, such as the 
>charitable
> >>>wing of the B'nai Brith.  So?
> >>>   Are we be back to yet another discussion of who is REALLY a Jew and 
>who
> >>>has the right to be?  I'll have to check with my Irish Jewish great
> >>>Grandfather on that one!
> >>>   As for Judaism and Jewish culture being "cool" we could do worse.  I
> >>>find
> >>>that people who are actually interested in Jews stick around long past 
>the
> >>>fads.  These coolniks actually come to Jewish Music concerts...ya know?
> >>>      Zei Gezunt
> >>>      Trudi the G, LR (Lepracohen in Residence)
> >>>
> >>>>From: Ari Davidow <ari (at) ivritype(dot)com>
> >>>>Reply-To: jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
> >>>>To: World music from a Jewish slant <jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org>
> >>>>Subject: Making Judaism Cool
> >>>>Date: Sun, 18 Jun 2000 21:07:59 -0400
> >>>>
> >>>>There is an interesting take on new Jewish music from the March 
>edition
> >>>>of Tikkun magazine that I just discovered:
> >>>>
> >>>>http://www.tikkun.org/0003/0003schorsh.html
> >>>>
> >>>>I think there's some meat there worth discussing, if anyone else is
> >>>>interested. Certainly the "cool" issue as regards new Jewish music, as
> >>>>used
> >>>>by the author, rings a bell. The author also peripherally touches on 
>an
> >>>>issue raised obliquely by Ruth Wisse in her review of Henry's
> >>>>book--klezmer, or
> >>>>cool new Jewish music, on their own, do not carry a Jewish life.
> >>>>
> >>>>That doesn't matter, if one is appreciating the music because it is
> >>>>exciting, wonderful, Jewish soul music (to the extent that the best
> >>>>new Jewish music is those things), and it has nothing to do with how
> >>>>one live's one's life or one's identity as a person.
> >>>>
> >>>>It is absolutely irrelevant for those people already immersed in
> >>>>Jewish life, for whom a variety of new Jewish music (not necessarily
> >>>>klezmer or "cool") is a living part of that life.
> >>>>
> >>>>But for many of us, this new Jewish music is something more than the
> >>>>soundtrack to struggles with defining who we are as Jews. As people
> >>>>living Jewishly outside the mainstream of Jewish life, or trying to
> >>>>influence the Jewish mainstream to our own political or cultural
> >>>>visions, the music carries additional weight and relevance.
> >>>>
> >>>>And, yet, I suspect that for many of the people about whom the author
> >>>>of this article is writing, this "cool" is enough, or is substituting
> >>>>for something deeper. Roseanne leading kabala study, indeed!
> >>>>
> >>>>Anyway, as I said, if the article strikes any of these chords, let's
> >>>>do discuss it.
> >>>>
> >>>>http://www.tikkun.org/0003/0003schorsh.html
> >>>>
> >>>>ari
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Ari Davidow
> >>>>ari (at) ivritype(dot)com
> >>>>list owner, jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
> >>>>the klezmer shack: http://www.klezmershack.com/
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
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