RE: separate services

[Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky <reyzl...>]

Sue,

I think you misunderstood what I wrote.  At Kane Street Synagogue, the 
oldest synagogue in Brooklyn, people sit wherever they like.  There are 
groups of teens, kids, single adults, but usually, couples and families sit 
together.  We always do and that's is how I like it.  But there are no 
seating rules at Kane Street except on High Holidays.  Kane Street is very 
heymish and friendly, besides being an absolutely, astoundingly beautiful 
shul.  The sanctuary is so beautiful that, for me, at least, it is always a 
spiritually uplifting just to be there.


When I wrote about my parents' synagogue in Canarsie, Brooklyn, I didn't 
have time to add the following.  Men sitting in the mekhitsa section in the 
middle part of the synagogue could plainly see the faces of the women 
sitting in the perpendicular rows of the women's section, around the 
bal-tfila in the very front section of the synagogue.  If any man really 
had a problem with that, then he could not be attend services there.  Now 
these were older, highly modest, frum women married to the very frum 
husbands on the facing side.  Any fashionably-dressed, attractive young 
daughters those pious women might have had did not sit with the mothers in 
that section.  They sat elsewhere.  One of those women was not so old and 
was a live wire who loved mixed dancing (she married a much older, very 
religious man right after the war who nebekh wouldn't dance with her.) 
 Well, if anyone had problems with this lively, wonderful woman who 
attended regularly, that was just too bad, I guess.  I, and everyone else, 
always loved her and I still do.  She and her husband, were the mainstays 
of the shul.  This shul was rather small, actually shtibl size, and this 3 
part arrangement was the best of what these survivors, mostly from small 
towns, worked out in their post-Holocaust American life.  Life changed 
after the war and this was the compromise the men worked out with their 
wives, their children, and modernity.

What I described above was the High Holiday seating.  I don't know how 
things were worked out on a regular shabes, because my mother and I didn't 
go with my father to shul on Shabes.  (My mother was too angry at God for 
the Holocaust and I went to counter-culture havurah services when not at 
home.)  I believe that they had the mekhitsa section in the front and mixed 
seating in the back, but I am not sure about the very front section with 
women sitting on one side of the bal-tfila.  That two-gendered section was 
unique and I have never seen it anywhere else.

Reyzl

----------
From:  David & Susan Esterman [SMTP:estermans (at) paradise(dot)net(dot)nz]
Sent:  Saturday, May 12, 2001 1:15 AM
To:  World music from a Jewish slant
Subject:  RE: separate services

Like many things, I think it depends on the shul you go to. Our progressive
services where we sit mixed are very heimish, regardless. We don't have a
"families sit together" rule, except on VERY solemn days, and even then 
it's
a recommendation.
So our teenagers often sit together, friends sit together, partners
sometimes sit separately, and it doesn't seem to matter one bit.
It's still a really good feeling.
However people who are not used to that obviously might not find the same
level of comfort, and really that's what matters - it's how YOU feel that 
is
the issue, There's no way that I can see to find a one-size-fits-all shul -
and frankly, then we'd remove one discussion thread from the list!
Sue

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
[mailto:owner-jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org]On Behalf Of glenn tamir
Sent: Saturday, 12 May 2001 15:36
To: World music from a Jewish slant
Subject: Re: separate services

If there was ever an example of how separate IS NOT
equal it's a shul with a Mehitza.  Perhaps there are
some where the torah is read in the middle and not on
the "men's" side, or where the women are "allowed" to
dance around the Torah like the men do.  When I attend
a shul with an uneven separation, I get very
uncomfortable.  It's almost like the women are sitting
at the back of the bus.

Oh, and by the way, why shouldn't a woman/girl be able
to wrestle?

Just my opinion...

--- "Yakov (Koby)" <kchodosh (at) suffolk(dot)lib(dot)ny(dot)us> wrote:
>
> To use an unfortuate expression, I think services
> should be separate but equal. Like gym class.
> Everyone goes to phys ed. Everyone plays tennis,
> everyone plays soccer, everyone plays badminton, but
> just separately. When gym class is combined, for
> various reasons the overall level of the activity is
> somewhat lowered. I know I have enjoyed going to
> services and not having to sit with my mother or
> sister. On the men's side at least, there's a very
> heymish atmosphere, very friendly, that you just
> don't get in mixed services. What I DON'T agree with
> in ortholand is the women just standing there. I
> think they could be praying somewhere else or
> something.
>
> (btw: analogy notwithstanding certain cases... like
> in my school, the guys do wrestling, and the girls
> do step aerobics :P )
>
> YAKOV.
> http://www.geocities.com/pdestructo
> http://klezkadets.cjb.net
> "You have one amazing appendage, Professor
> Hamilton."
> - John Henry Irons, Superman: The Man of Steel #109
>
> ---------------------- jewish-music (at) shamash(dot)org
> ---------------------+
>