RE: Nitl (corrected spelling)

[Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky <reyzl...>]

Dear Harvey,

Don't worry, I have no intentions of responding to the muck. 

Someone else wrote me today that they had heard of the toilet paper 
cutting before.   I have also.   But I think that this used to be done in 
American yeshivas or perhaps in Western European yeshivas, 
but not in Eastern Europe.  As a former student in a Brooklyn Hasidic 
girls yeshiva, we were told that toilet-paper cutting for the year is what
was happening the boys yeshivas and shuls on Christmas Eve.   But 
in America, Jews going out on Christmas was not a problem.  

In Poland, the Ukraine and Lithuania at least, it was very scary to go 
out at night and Jews made sure to stay home because one never 
knew if those roving bands would beat you up if you stepped out of 
your house.   Jews did not go to the synagogue or bes-medrish on 
Christmas Eve in those countries for safety reasons.   So this 
toilet-paper cutting is not credible and I have never heard or read of 
such accounts from there.    Second, even if it had been done in one
place where safety was not an issue, e.g., one of the large yeshivas
which would have had an attached dormitory-like quarters for its 
students, that still does not warrant making the generalization in the 
way that Alex made it that is what Jews generally did on Christmas
Eve.   

I'd like to hear the source of your shabes host's info of toilet-paper cutting. 
  

>Incidentally, he attributed the Yiddish word "Nitl"
>to the English/Latin Natal, referring to Christmas as Jesus's natal day.

That's correct.   But in my traditional, Yiddish-speaking house and 
neighborhood, we never used the word.   We used to call the holiday 
"kratsmakh" which literally mean 'scratch me'.   


Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky



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From:  Harvey Narrol[SMTP:hnarrol (at) bgumail(dot)bgu(dot)ac(dot)il]
Sent:  Monday, December 29, 1997 5:36 PM
To:  Reyzl Kalifowicz-Waletzky
Cc:  World music from a Jewish slant.
Subject:  Re: Nitl (corrected spelling)

Hi Rezl!
I hope to stay out of all the "ad hominem" that both sides of this issue
have been subjecting the group to. The fact is, I was delighted to see
both your original messages re: Nit(t)l when I read my e-mail Motz'ei
Shabbat. I had eaten Shabbat lunch with a very learned orthodox Jew who,
with great delight, told all assembled about the hesitation re: studying
Torah on Christmas Eve and about both substitute activities -- tearing the
year's supply of toilet paper and card playing -- that were often recom-
mended or engaged in. Next time I see him I will try to discover the
source of his remarks. Incidentally, he attributed the Yiddish word "Nitl"
to the English/Latin Natal, referring to Christmas as Jesus's natal day.

Harvey Narrol
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<****************************>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
The more things change, 
the more they stay insane!