[HANASHIR:11271] Re: Response to Shirona and Sholom.

[Shirona <shirona...>]

Dear Judah,

With respect to your considerable effort and many words - I'm not sure I get
your point...

You are absolutely right that I started with an assumption.  Without
searching Arabic song books or interviewing Arab dj's I made an assumption
that few, if any, songs about peace exist in the Arab world. (All great
theories start with an assumption...;-)  If I turn out to be wrong - it will
raise my hope by a few notches and I will apologize to you and whoever else
was "offended" by my assumption.  But it's with a heavy heart that I believe
I am right... even after all your technical objections.  How to interpret
this yet-to-be-proved fact is a whole other story...

I posted the same message on the other Jewish music list at Shamash, where
the members are all musicians, musicologists, archivists - and no one so far
produces any evidence to the contrary. Perhaps you're up to the
challenge...Alot more can be said about this, but not tonight...

All the best,

Shirona

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Singer, Songwriter and Teacher of Jewish Music
 Visit my website at    www.shirona.com
Listen to my music at www.mp3.com/shirona
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

----- Original Message -----
From: "Judah Cohen" <jcohen (at) fas(dot)harvard(dot)edu>
To: <hanashir (at) shamash(dot)org>
Sent: Tuesday, April 09, 2002 7:42 PM
Subject: [HANASHIR:11269] Response to Shirona and Sholom.


> Shirona and Sholom,
>
>    The way I see it, you are trying to say two different (and relatively
> incompatible) things here at the same time.
>    Yes, I am aware of the anti-Semitic incidents at the hands of Muslims
> around the world.  I have no intention of going into denial about them.
At
> the same time, however, it is almost ludicrous to imply from this that
> Muslim songs don't speak of peace.  What I read in your message was that
you
> found all the Jewish/Israeli peace repertoire by looking in songbooks;
how,
> then, can you assume the "lack" of Arabic peace repertoire by looking in
the
> newspapers?  (If you had used the same technique to locate peace songs by
> Israelis, they wouldn't have come out looking nearly as good.)  That's why
I
> suggested you redirect your search toward a group of people who ARE
Muslims,
> and may be able to present you with songbooks of their own.  Then,
perhaps,
> you can gain the information you sought in order to make a fairer
> comparison.
>    And as far as "awareness" goes--it should be more than clear that not
all
> awareness is the same.  Taking an American example, I'd be interested to
see
> how Britney Spears's "Oops, I did it again" reflects your formula that
what
> "people write and sing and listen to are as close to the 'heart' of the
> matter as anything."  Likewise with Ice-T's "Cop Killer."  Yes, on the
> surface of it, these hardly bear comparison to the Egyptian song "I Hate
> Israel."  But that's the point:  the number of copies sold does not
> necessarily reflect the deepest hopes or beliefs of an entire people.  In
> this case, it seems the heat of the time period (made hotter by Israel's
> operations in the West Bank) has caused an obscure song to gain national
> attention through consumption by a certain demographic of people (i.e.,
> mainly young people and students) particualrly prone to protests.
Further,
> the "I Hate Israel" phenomenon should be seen in its own context:  that
> Egypt currently has one of the strongest and most effective policies of
> anti-Muslim-extremism in the Middle East; that recent protests have been
> contained by Egyptian police; that the city actively supports at least two
> historic synagogues; and that at least up until recently, Israelis could
> walk through the streets of Cairo with relatively little difficulty (I
went
> with a group of students in the Fall of 1999, flew into the country on El
> Al, and twice explored deep into the markets and local areas alone with
> little more than a few smiles--the hardest time I had was trying to find
an
> empty seat on the plane).  Sure, the song's popularity means something;
but
> presenting it as a single, undocumented swipe (and yes, Sholom, it would
> have been much more meaningful to me if you had more careful in presenting
> your one-liner) presents only one part of a much more complicated
situation:
> it does not explain everything.
>    And frankly, I find your comparison to the Holocaust to be
irresponsible
> and unnecessarily alarmist.  Yes, these recent acts of anti-Semitism are
> terrible.  Yet even the most damning accounts of the Holocaust (I'm
thinking
> especially of Goldhagen's "Hitler's Willing Executioners") describe the
> civilian aggression as taking place *in concert* with an organized
> government professing a clear anti-Jewish agenda.  That is NOT what is
> taking place here--European governments are condemning the anti-Jewish
> activity, just as they condemned the anti-Muslim incidents that took place
> after September 11.  On this, Yom HaShoah, perhaps we should also learn to
> be very, very careful when we yell "Holocaust!" in a crowded political
> theater.
>     Finally, to incorporate Jerry Kaye's fascinating post:  many of our
> songs of peace are not all that politically neutral either (though
granted,
> they're not about blood and martyrdom).  Maybe I'm overstepping my bounds
> here, but it's certainly worth thinking about.  "Shalom" carries with it a
> connotation of keeping the status quo, just without conflict--but with
that
> comes the implication that Israel and the Jewish people are happy with
what
> they have, and will not give it up.  It seems, looking at the songbooks I
> have, that our songs became a lot more "Shalom"-centered AFTER Israel was
> founded.  At least based on a quick perusal of Moshe Nathanson's 1939
> "Shireinu" songbook, the few songs that included the word "Shalom" applied
> the word directly to the Jews ("Sim Shalom") or to Jewish practices
("Shalom
> Aleichem").  Compare that with the end of Psalm 137, describing the
> post-Biblical exile of the Jewish people (the beginning of which I've
heard
> several congregations sing at their Yom HaShoah services as "By the Waters
> of Babylon"):  "O violated daughter of Babylon!  Praise to the one who
> repays you in the manner that you have dealt with us // Praise to the one
> who will clutch and dash your infants against the rock."  Jews had their
> paeans of revenge as well while in exile; but once they reached a
situation
> with which they were comfortable (i.e., the restoration of Israel), then
the
> desire for peace broke out.  I make no excuses for Palestinian anger or
> violence.  However, might it be possible that for BOTH Israelis and
> Palestinians what is stated as "Peace" on one side might be interpreted by
> the other as exclusion, conquest or oppression--especially when both sides
> lay claim to the same land?
>
> Be well.
> Judah Cohen.
>
>
>


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